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Vulcan 3.0 and Duratec 3.0


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#1 Wicked_Sludge

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Posted 11 November 2006 - 07:42 PM

I normaly dont sign up to a forum to just ask one question, but in this case it was a last resort...so please forgive me.

The question has come up over at The Ranger Station several times about swapping the 3.0 vulcan used in the ranger and explorers for a 3.0 duratec used in the taurus/sable and escapes. There are inherent problems with using a FWD engine in a RWD application, but most of those are easy enough to overcome. The big issue, and the one noone has been able to find a definate answer for so far, is which transmissions will bolt onto the duratec 3.0 block.

Ive come up with two possabilities for using a stock ranger tranny:
1. I've heard, but am unable to verify, that the Vulcan and Duratec 3.0's share the same bellhousing bolt pattern. If thats true then the RWD M5OD tranny used for the vulcan in the rangers should bolt right to the duratec.
2. If the 3.0 vulcan and duratec bolt patterns are different, does the duratec 3.0 have the same bellhousing pattern as the 2.3L duratec?

Ive searched the web for many moons try to find information on this but havnt been able to find a concrete answer. If you guys could shed some light on this it would be a huge help, thanks.

#2 D's nuts

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Posted 11 November 2006 - 07:48 PM

I normaly dont sign up to a forum to just ask one question, but in this case it was a last resort...so please forgive me.

The question has come up over at The Ranger Station several times about swapping the 3.0 vulcan used in the ranger and explorers for a 3.0 duratec used in the taurus/sable and escapes. There are inherent problems with using a FWD engine in a RWD application, but most of those are easy enough to overcome. The big issue, and the one noone has been able to find a definate answer for so far, is which transmissions will bolt onto the duratec 3.0 block.

Ive come up with two possabilities for using a stock ranger tranny:
1. I've heard, but am unable to verify, that the Vulcan and Duratec 3.0's share the same bellhousing bolt pattern. If thats true then the RWD M5OD tranny used for the vulcan in the rangers should bolt right to the duratec.
2. If the 3.0 vulcan and duratec bolt patterns are different, does the duratec 3.0 have the same bellhousing pattern as the 2.3L duratec?

Ive searched the web for many moons try to find information on this but havnt been able to find a concrete answer. If you guys could shed some light on this it would be a huge help, thanks.

Yep and escape or tribut tranny would work. They have the 3.0 duratech in them

#3 BuckeyeSVT

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Posted 11 November 2006 - 09:56 PM

I'm sorry, some people speak out of context - Everyone knows the Tribute and Escape share nothing with the Ranger platform. The only issues I could see that would be problematic with using a 3.0L Duratec is the engine mounting and bellhousing. I haven't heard of anyone mating the M50D with the Duratec - However the Taurus Duratec does use a FWD AX4N/S transmission that shares the same bellhousing pattern with the Vulcan 3.0L.

Without looking at both it would be anyone's guess if it would work. However, I would venture to estimate that it may work based on other uses for the Vulcan. If the Ranger Vulcan has the same bellhousing pattern as the Taurus Vulcan you may be in good shape.

-Dom

#4 D's nuts

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Posted 11 November 2006 - 11:50 PM

I'm sorry, some people speak out of context - Everyone knows the Tribute and Escape share nothing with the Ranger platform. The only issues I could see that would be problematic with using a 3.0L Duratec is the engine mounting and bellhousing. I haven't heard of anyone mating the M50D with the Duratec - However the Taurus Duratec does use a FWD AX4N/S transmission that shares the same bellhousing pattern with the Vulcan 3.0L.

Without looking at both it would be anyone's guess if it would work. However, I would venture to estimate that it may work based on other uses for the Vulcan. If the Ranger Vulcan has the same bellhousing pattern as the Taurus Vulcan you may be in good shape.

-Dom

Ok since DOM wants to email me cryn that i gave you the wrong info and threatn to kick me off, I will go ahead and say I was wrong. I wnet and check the specs on the escape and its FWD plat form. I jsut assumed i wa RWD and it MIGHT work cause it sites in like a RWD car..... MY BAD shawty! I guess i should have sai something like " maybe a escape will work I think they are RWD and got a 3L duratech" But I didnt...Im sorry please dont tell me you already went and bought a escape tranny. PLEASE PLEASE PLEASE dont tell me that! DOM might have a cow.

#5 Wicked_Sludge

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 01:24 AM

haha, no i didnt run out and buy an escape TRANSAXLE ;)

There have been one or two guys that, in need of an engine, have swapped the vulcan 3.0 out of a FWD application and bolted it to the stock ranger tranny (involves flipping the plenum, changing accessory brackets, ect, ect). so if the vulcan and duratec share the same tranny in the taurus, then that means they have the same bellhousing bolt patter and would (in theory!) bolt to any vulcan ranger tranny.

Now getting the intake and thermostat housing (which would both be burried in the firewall in a ranger) sorted out is a whole other mess...but getting it to bolt to the tranny without adapter plates and whatnot is a major step in doing such a swap. B)

#6 D's nuts

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 09:05 AM

haha, no i didnt run out and buy an escape TRANSAXLE ;)

There have been one or two guys that, in need of an engine, have swapped the vulcan 3.0 out of a FWD application and bolted it to the stock ranger tranny (involves flipping the plenum, changing accessory brackets, ect, ect). so if the vulcan and duratec share the same tranny in the taurus, then that means they have the same bellhousing bolt patter and would (in theory!) bolt to any vulcan ranger tranny.

Now getting the intake and thermostat housing (which would both be burried in the firewall in a ranger) sorted out is a whole other mess...but getting it to bolt to the tranny without adapter plates and whatnot is a major step in doing such a swap. B)

Now im sure DOM will chim in if im wronmg but im not syaing im right. But maybe the intake can be turned around like I did with the fuel rail. When I did my motorswap on my contour the 3L comes out on the pass side. I just fliped it around to work with mmy fuel lines on the drivers side. So im not saying you can but maybe you can do it with the intake too. Hmm ill look today cause im putting diff injectors in my car.

#7 BuckeyeSVT

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 10:20 AM

The only issue I see in flipping the intake around is the cam drive valve cover interference. Remember the valve covers are raised on the ends (towards the belt drive) to allow for the camshaft sprockets and chain clearance. This is not the case in the normal intake mounting - Therefore even though it is entirely possible to rotate the intake 180 degrees, you may have a fit or clearance issue that could prevent it from working. Nothing a LIM shim wouldn't take care of though..lol. However keep in mind the EGR position on the Duratec and how the pipe comes from the manifold up - You would also have to reverse the manifolds as well to make it work (i.e. front manifold on the rear and rear on the front...etc).

-Dom

#8 Wicked_Sludge

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 11:04 AM

Spacers (like THESE) for the plenum would definatly be the key if I were ever to do such a swap. but fabbing up a custom intake (same PAGE, later date) would also be an option. I think custom headers would be the way to go as far as exhaust is concerned. the water neck could be righted with a custom bent hard 'U' pipe, to get it facing the right direction.

What about an oil pan? Isnt that an integral part of the transaxle in the taurus?

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#9 BuckeyeSVT

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 01:00 PM

Oil pan? No, the oil pan bolts into the trans for structural rigidity. It is not required for the trans to work and the trans is not needed to make the oil pan complete. The pan has two flanges on the backside that allow thru bolting the pan to the trans. That's all.

-Dom

#10 spridget

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 03:08 PM

They are kinda hard to find, but the Getrag unit from the early Lincoln LS V6 is a direct fit to the Duratec.

#11 Wicked_Sludge

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Posted 12 November 2006 - 11:45 PM

Alright, i knew the oil pan bolted to the transaxle, i just didnt know if it was neccissary for the pan to seal.

I also found out about the getrag during my quest for a definate answer, but the original idea was to use the stock ranger transmission, so the information didnt help much. You could probably get the duratec and getrag in the ranger chassis, but i think 4wd would be out of the question, and thats a BIG problem for alot of us at TRS ;)