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ChrisDKST200

Hi fellow Ford'sters - looking for opinions on a 3.0 ST200 conversion

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Hi guys.

 

 

I am getting really excited as my project is nearing the starting phases.

 

I live in Denmark, an we call the Contour, Mondeo here. The SVT is called ST200 producing 205hp, the old engine anyway ;)

 

I'm  importing a ST220 from Berlin, a 3.0l 226hp version from 2006, with the full package including the biggest satnav at that point, with only 104.000km on the clock. Paying only 1800$ This is f'in cheap! But the car got reared by a truck so, uh..

 

My plans are as following:

 

Full 3l swap also using the 6 speed gearbox (Capable of 400hp so it should do nicely). Using cougar engine mounts

Using Cams from ST200 (More aggresive in the profile, can this actually be done on this version of the 3.0? I know its possible on the pre 04' models with 220 hp)

75mm Throttlebody from the Mustang V6.

Full exhaust overhaul including:

New headers - from ebay, they cost about 310$

Blueflame exhaust. I've been told it has a real nice sound tho i don't think making it sound nice will be a problem at all ;) )

And Decatting aswell ofcause.

I might have forgotten something, but when all the above is done it will be remapped to make it all play together nicely.

 

The suspension will also be upgraded aswell as the body needs a little repairing, but the engine and related are an priority. The 300mm front brakes will also be swapped along with the 280mm rearbrakes.

 

I hope for 250+ atleast at the crank - i would be sad if it strikes 270 crank hp either.

And a nice new 0 - 100 km/h time which is 7,1 sec right now. I hope for less that 6,5 with weight reduction as well if needed.

 

What are your opinions on this ambitious project? Do you got any tips'n'ideas please feel free to share them, i am just as excited as you guys, im looking really forward to working with this project.

 

I will be starting around week 19 till 21. and hope on finish the car at this point, as much as possible anyway.

 

I am also looking at maybe swapping the satnav and somehow make it work, if not impossible.

I'm also taking the stearing wheel and the dash needles and stuff like that, if you have any ideas in the matter of using bits from the ST220 please share as well, this car will be really unique.

 

 

Regards

Denmark - Christian.

Edited by ChrisDKST200

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This forum is a little slow  :yahoo:

 

I have a additional question, my old 2.5 svt engine had the death rattle, is it possible to fix? Or should i just get rid of it. Im gonna take the cams anyway but it could be a fun project later.

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WOW - hearing from Denmark!!! This is way cool - very little I know of your "project", having never done one USA style, with our known resources and local parts availability. So commenting on your "project" can only be subjective - WOW!!!!

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Firstly, i have gotten this confirmed before, but i need it confirmed again. I need the Cougar mounts for the 3l engine to fit the mk2 bay, right? (I need to be 300% sure as this stupid part is hugemongously, i just invented that word, expensive in Denmark)

 

Yeah well, England and USA are really the only countries doing the conversion, so everybody is like "Dude, thats not possible, it will break and explode'n'shoot beams n shiz".. But obviously i know different. What are your 0-60 times in a fully build 3L? And what do you guys produce?

I hope for 270hp with 245 of them, atleast, being whp. I need this to beat my friends Prelude (Tho he hasnt even started building on the thing)

 

 

Thankfully, in Denmark, the laws for tuning is rediculously strict (Unless you don't know the difference of the 2.5 and 3.0 in the bay) so with my sleeper im gonna be eating a lot of cars for dinner. 

 

 

So i've been using this board, and a UK one for ideas, nobody has any clue what to do, here in Denmark, people think of it as too much work and too much money, they usually go with cars that tunes really easy, but thats not the f'in point in this build. It's gonna be really unique, the only one in Denmark. Which is also why i am doing it. And the fact that Ford is just what keeps my heart beating ;) 

 

Anyway, i can't wait to get started, unfortunately it won't be before May (I have a savings account ready for then) I'm gonna spend about 5000$ on the engine (maybe a bit less) so i really hope it's gonna be a beast :) I don't care about reselling as i will probably never sell the vehicle again due to its uniqueness.

 

A few other question tho, i was thinking of installing mk3 needles in the mk2 speedo, and also take the sat nav ( I take it fits the original radioframe? DIN2 right?) but other than that its gonna be kept original.. Well besides for the custom leather cab, and some other small detail (Like the illuminating seats when the doors open) BUT other than that, i have no plans :)

Edited by ChrisDKST200

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Chris -

 

You may already know this, but in the US we never got the Mk3 Mondeo - after MY2000 the Contour was discontinued and effectively replaced by a Ford/Mazda project, the Fusion.

 

Reason I mention that is that almost no one here will really know any details about a Mk3 such as a MY2006 ST220.  Having said that, it sounds like a cool project!

 

I'm sure the 2.5 is fixable, will need a fair amount of work assuming it's a conrod bearing.

 

I'm no expert on the 3.0 conversion (my 2.5SVT still runs fine) but I think that I'd probably stay with the ST220 cams for a broader power curve.  Showing my ignorance is the ST220 a DAMB or a roller rocker head?  Over here the higher power 3.0s were DAMB and therefore I'm sure cams would not interchange.

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Hehe no worries about the Mk3. The engine is a Duratec30, the exact same one which you guys use for your conversions, just a european edition, they are basicly the same but may have been modded on the intake side a little. After a bit of research, i think it uses Direct acting mechanical bucket, but i'm only 75% sure. Exact engine code is MEBA if that rings a bell.

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Sorry for doublepost:

Here is a detailed analysis on the SVT cams vs. 2004 Taurus 3L cams! 

 

http://www.contour.org/ceg-vb/showthread.php?41057-SVT-Cams-vs.-3.0L-Cams-The-Real-Difference

 

Basicly the SVT cams opens earlier, (Making them open longer) allowing more air and petrol into the engine giving you more power, which we like.

In order to fully exploit the power potential, you should have your ECU remapped.

 

Tho i think my 3L MEBA Ford engine uses direct acting mechanical buckets, and im not exactly sure what the 2.5 engine uses?

Edited by ChrisDKST200

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"Our" 2.5L, like the Taurus (and some other) 3.0L engines, had roller rockers.  I think your 2.5L does too, it's virtually identical I think.  Some of the higher output 3.0L (probably including yours) engines had DAMB.  Most (maybe all?) of the 2.5 > 3.0 swaps here are using roller rocker engines.

 

I have no experience with the 3.0 DAMB engine, but it seems very unlikely that cams from a roller rocker (2.5L or 3L) and a DAMB engine could interchange.  I understand that you can indeed exchange cams between the roller rocker engines, which is what the link above discusses.

 

So unless I'm mistaken, it won't work.  Typically the lobe shape of a roller and a flat tappet cam are a fair bit different, has to do with the details of how the lobe and the roller vs lobe and flat lifter surface intersect.

 

Does the ST220 engine have variable cam timing? 

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Hmm - reading Dom's ST220 thread, maybe your engine is in fact a roller rocker engine??  In which case the cams likely would interchange.  Not saying it's the best choice of course...

 

If Terry is reading (I assume Dom is gone?) he probably knows about the ST220 engine!

 

As far as cam choice, if it were me I'd probably stick with the ST220 to keep the nice fat torque curve.

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Okay, i now researched abit more, (From talkford) and i must conclude (tho there is no direct evidence) that the Duratec30 ST (There is also a SE producing 206hp vs 226hp from the ST) uses RRF BECAUSE, the topic i found constantly talks about the AJ6 version upgraded to VVT and DAMP.

 

That leads me to believe that the ST220 Engine aka Duratec30 ST, uses RRF and has no VVT appearently.

 

Where does this put me in terms of tuning? I've heard RRF doesnt allow for high rpm? And DAMB is a more durable solution?

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I cannot edit????

 

Anyway, i am now sure the Duratec 30 ST uses RRF, i am not sure about the timing. Anyway, if it is possible, i will interchange the cams, the ST200 cams shreds 2 seconds of a 100km/h to 200km/h run.

 

Some dude uploaded this video for a board showing a drive with st200 cams in a 3.0l engine.

 

The difference is quite significant.

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Hmm - reading Dom's ST220 thread, maybe your engine is in fact a roller rocker engine??  In which case the cams likely would interchange.  Not saying it's the best choice of course...

 

If Terry is reading (I assume Dom is gone?) he probably knows about the ST220 engine!

 

As far as cam choice, if it were me I'd probably stick with the ST220 to keep the nice fat torque curve.

Dom is still "with us" and alive and kicking. He is currently very busy on "other projects". As far as this thread, I can add the following thread, which clears up a few (not all) of the questions raised so far (and good questions they are) - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ford_Mondeo_V6_engine    Hope this helps some. Keeping my eye open for a Lincoln LS donor car :yahoo:

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Im glad to hear that John, makes it alot easier!

 

 

But now this happened, the guy that was supposed to sell me the ST220 just called it off. I have no idea why, so now my whole project has come to a complete halt.. again..

 

Nobody wants to ship to Denmark, and there are no engines in Denmark appearently because the ST220 never did sell in Denmark really.

 

I also refuse to use the Escape engine as it lacks the power i need to make this project unique. (Also do to strict rules in Denmark, i cannot use forced induction - a fine would be around 65.000$ if the cops would notice, and they do)

Edited by ChrisDKST200

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Did you see Dom's (former site owner) post re ST220 at the top of this subforum?  (Edit - I see you did as you posted to it)

 

If I understand it correctly, the ST220 is (mostly?) just a normal 3.0 Duratec with a tune.  Thus an Escape engine + tune (or Escape engine + ST200 cams + tune) should get you to the same place I think.  Some people on these Contour forums have certainly made a lot of power using "normal" 3.0s with or without SVT/ST200 cams.

Edited by 2000SVTC

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