Terry Haines Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 .....have dirty exhaust for USA... *Nope ,a number of Euro countries have higher than Ca... *Cost of diesel cars... ...yes the engines are a little more expensive but most here is caused by Fed rule that put a duty/tax on any diesel cars ,either import or domestic produced... *Must have low sulphur fuel... ...yes and no...We 'could' have had low sulphur fuel years ago...Jets fly with 'no sulphur fuel'...ever wonder why? (clue...NOT emissions) ...time to wake up and see the 'real' reasons Euro's have 50% + diesel cars and we have almost zip!!!(forget fuel cost and taxes etc..just look at better MPG!) Call your senator and ask WHY do we have rules that deter cars that can get 40+MPG...!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 2, 2008 Share Posted June 2, 2008 .....have dirty exhaust for USA... *Nope ,a number of Euro countries have higher than Ca... *Cost of diesel cars... ...yes the engines are a little more expensive but most here is caused by Fed rule that put a duty/tax on any diesel cars ,either import or domestic produced... *Must have low sulphur fuel... ...yes and no...We 'could' have had low sulphur fuel years ago...Jets fly with 'no sulphur fuel'...ever wonder why? (clue...NOT emissions) ...time to wake up and see the 'real' reasons Euro's have 50% + diesel cars and we have almost zip!!!(forget fuel cost and taxes etc..just look at better MPG!) Call your senator and ask WHY do we have rules that deter cars that can get 40+MPG...!!!! it's a good idea, but many people remember the days of the 125 hp Eldorado that got 15mpg and the olds that was close to the same. The car companies did little justice for the rep of diesel. Also diesel is only about 10% of car sales, so there is little demand. US car makers seem to be more interested in hybrid elect/gas vehicles. So one would think the oil refiners in the south have their hands in a few pockets to keep the gasoline engines around. Or it's the manufactures unwillingness to re-tool their machines for a diesel set up.I have read that VW has intended to start shipping more TDI's in the next few years from 6800 units to 12,000 per year. And if ford brings a Volvo plant to the US like they have stated what are the chances that it'll be for a diesel car? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ...it's a good idea, but many people remember the days of the 125 hp Eldorado ...who gives a s**t now. 50% of Euro cars are diesel...Just look at the Ford Europe website and see the diesel engine mpg etc.. ....as for 'many people'..too many think the world ends at the east and west coast...or the state line....You sound like your too have been brainwashed!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 Huh? Did you read all of my post or just the parts you thought to make a point of? Maybe I should take a pic of the locimotive here at the yard (I can not or I'd be fired) and show you American diesel polution at it's best. When it takes of the whole neighborhood is covered in polution for 2 or 3 minutes. There's no brainwashing here, so no reason to point fingers and make acusations that are unfounded. Come to MN and drive into work with me one day. Not only at work but some of the drivers also have trucks that leave a huge cloud of smoke when they take off. I laugh when Euros say things like diesel is better. Yeah in europe, here they suck and do more harm than you can imagine. The euro models are cool but people here don't know what to do with that sh!t. So we move on in another direction and what's wrong with diversity, white boy? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 (edited) Huh? Did you read all of my post or just the parts you thought to make a point of? Maybe I should take a pic of the locimotive here at the yard (I can not or I'd be fired) and show you American diesel polution at it's best. When it takes off the whole neighborhood is covered in polution for 2 or 3 minutes. There's no brainwashing here, so no reason to point fingers and make acusations that are unfounded. Come to MN and drive into work with me one day. Not only at work but some of the drivers also have trucks that leave a huge cloud of smoke when they take off. I laugh when Euros say things like diesel is better. Yeah in europe, here they suck and do more harm than you can imagine. The euro models are cool but people here don't know what to do with that sh!t. So we move on in another direction and what's wrong with diversity, white boy? Edited June 3, 2008 by dub Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 but people here don't know what to do with that sh!t. ...well it's time to learn eh!!!...You are not even on the same page with industrial diesel Vs small passenger car diesel engines. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 Ok then, what American car company makes affordable diesel cars here in the states? I have yet to see one if there is. So I speak of what I see and know. Help me out to understand that of which you speak. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ...the fed DON'T want you to have good MPG diesel car here! Ford has made it's own diesel engines/cars since the 80's in Europe...one of the biggest diesel engine plants in Europe at Dagenham , England. The current Focus, depending on engine size, will give back 40> 60+ average MPG...JUST LOOK...here.. http://www.ford.co.uk/ns7/focmca/co2_foc/c..._diesel/-/-/-/- Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 (edited) So... Then what would the price of a US gallon of diesel be? In the UK of course. Edited June 3, 2008 by dub Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ..a lot more than here.That is not the point..even with the US price of diesel why wouldn't you want to sell or have a car that does around 50MPG...WHY NOT??? No excuse ..Ford have the tech background etc...Closing plants in the USA..WHY NOT build a USA passenger car diesel engine plant? WHY NOT have a Focus that does 50+ MPG?..WHY NOT market the car as hard as say, 'mini vans'??? WHY NOT?????? WHY NOT turn round USA auto makers to make some money?...SUV and truck plants are closing all over... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ...doesn't this tell you that the use of trucks and SUV's for general day to day transport is now over in the USA? ca By TOM KRISHER, AP Auto Writer 35 minutes ago WILMINGTON, Del. - General Motors is closing four truck and SUV plants in the U.S., Canada and Mexico as surging fuel prices hasten a dramatic shift to smaller vehicles. ADVERTISEMENT CEO Rick Wagoner said Tuesday before the automaker's annual meeting in Delaware the plants to be closed are in Oshawa, Ontario; Moraine, Ohio; Janesville, Wis.; and Toluca, Mexico. He also said the iconic Hummer brand will be reviewed and potentially sold or revamped. Wagoner said the GM board has approved production of a new small Chevrolet car at a plant in Lordstown, Ohio, in mid-2010 and the Chevy Volt electric vehicle in Detroit. Wagoner announced the moves in response to slumping sales of pickups and SUVs brought on by high oil prices. He said a market shift to smaller vehicles is permanent. GM shares rose 25 cents, or 1.4 percent, to $17.69 in morning trading. The cuts will affect about 2,500 workers at each of the four facilities, although Wagoner did not know exact numbers. Many will be able to take openings created when 19,000 more U.S. hourly workers leave later this year through early retirement and buyout offers. He said the company has no plans to allocate products to the four plants in the future. "We really would not foresee the likely prospect of new products in the plants that we're announcing today that we'll cease production in," he told a Moraine, Ohio, city official who asked a question in a telephone conference call. The moves will save the company $1 billion per year starting in 2010. Combined with previous efforts, GM will have cut costs by $15 billion a year, Wagoner said. Wagoner said General Motors Corp.'s board approved the production schedule of the Chevrolet Volt, and the company plans to bring the plug-in electric car to showrooms by the end of 2010. The Volt runs on an electric motor and has a small engine to recharge its batteries. He said the change in the U.S. market to smaller vehicles likely is permanent. "We at GM don't think this is a spike or a temporary shift," Wagoner said. On the Hummer, Wagoner said GM is "undertaking a strategic review of the Hummer brand, to determine its fit with GM's evolving product portfolio" in light of changing market conditions. "At this point, we are considering all options for the Hummer brand... everything from a complete revamp of the product lineup to partial or complete sale of the brand," he said. The Detroit-based automaker has just emerged from a spate of labor problems, with two local union strikes at key factories and a nearly three-month strike at key parts maker American Axle and Manufacturing Holdings Inc. GM said in a recent regulatory filing the strikes will cost it a total of $2 billion before taxes in the second quarter. Detroit's automakers have been making the shift to more fuel-efficient vehicles, but not at the pace that matches consumers' drive to hybrids and high mileage models made overseas. Gas prices have accelerated the retreat from trucks and sport utility vehicles, leaving the Big Three at the most critical crossroads in 30 years. The U.S. market is difficult for every automaker, with consumer confidence weak and 2008 sales expected to be the lowest in more than a decade. But it is most difficult for the Detroit Three, who have relied more heavily on sales of trucks and SUVs than their foreign counterparts. Trucks make up 70 percent of Chrysler LLC's U.S. sales, for example, compared to 41 percent at Toyota Motor Corp. ....but not at the pace that matches consumers' drive to hybrids and high mileage models made overseas. Gas prices have accelerated the retreat from trucks and sport utility vehicles. WAKE UP AMERICA!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ....not everyone will listen to this diesel crap, just those in need of some financial help. ..Pity,you are just making the oil co's,OPEC, market traders etc richer..Glad you can still afford to do that on cars that don't even make 30MPG...seems daft to me. Haven't you got better things to spend your $$$ on than gas?....The further you go for the $$ the better...Sorry you think it's crap,pity. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 I don't like VW. Won't buy Mercades, so what other options do I have. So it is crap. Let's see I drove my f 150 for 6 years then I got this car in 06 and use it during the no snow months. So it being daft then your the punk for believing that. Come to think of it now, I was going to purchase an 89 shelby csx with 40 miles on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 3, 2008 Author Share Posted June 3, 2008 ...problem with German cars? You are correct,you have given yourself no options...The oil suppliers thank you for you $$$... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 ...problem with German cars? nope. Porsche, bmw and audi are cool with me. VW's get the worst interior stink from B.O. That can not be removed and Mercades was the first to jump when Hitler wanted to bomb NYC. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 (edited) Haven't you got better things to spend your $$$ on than gas?....The further you go for the $$ the better...Sorry you think it's crap,pity. and I drive 11 miles to work? The wife does 9 miles... Why... You? Edited June 3, 2008 by dub Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slow Cat Posted June 3, 2008 Share Posted June 3, 2008 The American public hears diesel & thinks horrible pollution, low power, bad smell, and a host of other negative things. They associate diesel with the reputation it used to have, people aren't educated on it, and don't care enough to educate themselves. A small turbo diesel engine can crush a large gas engine on torque, and with good gearing can match them for all out performance. I would venture to say it would even be more fun to drive on a daily basis because of the torque on tap at any speed. On top of all that it can beat even engines of the same size for fuel efficiency. But again, the American public doesn't see that, they see industry, and 1970's when they think of diesel. Congress won't change things for diesel cars to be easily sold in America until the public wants it, and the public won't want it until they see the "newer" diesel cars.... It's a catch 22 basically. I would love a small car like a Smart Roadster, esp. it id have a small turbo diesel... lots of power on tap in a small extremely fuel efficient & sport car would be an all around win to me. But that won't happen in America... it's sad but true. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dub Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 A small turbo diesel engine can crush a large gas engine on torque, "newer" diesel cars.... It's a catch 22 basically. a small turbo diesel.... . turbo turbo turbo? yeah and a diesel engine alone will struggle vs a gasoline engine with a turbo set up. lame point. turbo anything vs NA will have more performance. the real issue is smog. Americans will get the long awaited electric car very soon. we were offered them at the plant, but alot of strings came with it so only a few got them. the electric car will crush any engine turboed, NA, supercharged, or anything you compare it to. electric motors don't need time to move parts and such they move magnetic fields which are on another level compared to mechanics. soon mechanics will be getting laid-off and electricians will replace them. diversity in the market, not the world of Euro thought reigns supreme. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Slow Cat Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Ya electric cars.... fun stuff.... unless you need to drive more than 50 or 100 miles. Then again the Chevy Volt will be able to go 400 miles I think it was, but it also has an engine to charge the batteries. Batteries aren't powerful enough to make a pure electric car that is as flexible as any gas or diesel car. I like diesels, yes they need more emmissions controls to run as clean as a gas engine, but that's not the end of the world. They do have their positives, just like gas engines. I think the point he was trying to make is that in Europe people have the CHOICE to buy a diesel. In America because of legislation that CHOICE is mostly made for us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
giganto Posted June 4, 2008 Share Posted June 4, 2008 Ya electric cars.... fun stuff.... unless you need to drive more than 50 or 100 miles. Which, most of the time, you don't. Electric cars are commuter vehicles. Electric trains are commuter vehicles. They are both designed to go from point A to point B. Point C requires more planning. Then again the Chevy Volt will be able to go 400 miles I think it was, but it also has an engine to charge the batteries. Yep, it's a hybrid...a $40,000 hybrid. You get two cars in one for the price of...two cars. Sell your GM shares now, and stock up on parts if you have a GM car. Batteries aren't powerful enough to make a pure electric car that is as flexible as any gas or diesel car. I like diesels, yes they need more emmissions controls to run as clean as a gas engine, but that's not the end of the world. They do have their positives, just like gas engines. In designing my electric Mystique, I keep finding all the inefficiencies built into the IC engines. I have to bleed energy for power steering, A/C, heaters, and the inaccurate clock. At least when I get it rolling down the road, I won't have a 500 degree catalytic converter under me and an exhaust manifold right in front of the fresh inlets. Diesels need basically the same emmissions controls with low-sulfur fuel. The exhaust can trap soot until it's cooked into CO2. I think the point he was trying to make is that in Europe people have the CHOICE to buy a diesel. In America because of legislation that CHOICE is mostly made for us. The choice was made by the auto manufacturers' marketing departments. It seems American consumers have been convinced they need more horsepower every year, or why else would they feel the need for a new car about every five years? They didn't even bother selling the 1.8l gasoline or diesel Contour/Mystique/Mondeo in North America because they lacked oomph. American consumers didn't want seatbelts either, until "legislation" took away the automobile manufacturer's CHOICE to not spend an extra $20 to install them. It's not like they didn't know how to put them in, since european imports had them already and the pillars were already designed and manufactured with seatbelt mounting points. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 6, 2008 Author Share Posted June 6, 2008 ..so now we read 'death of the SUV', crude at $150 ,unemployment up etc etc....Think I'd still go for that Euro diesel car if the Motorcity had any here...but hey, not going to happen right! No bloody foresight in Detroit! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTDEMON Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 ..so now we read 'death of the SUV', crude at $150 ,unemployment up etc etc....Think I'd still go for that Euro diesel car if the Motorcity had any here...but hey, not going to happen right! No bloody foresight in Detroit! Even if they did bring them here they would be detuned and not worth jack remember the Golf TDI,now VW is doing a TD Jetta that gets 36mpg wow compared to 68mpg like 2 years earlier! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Terry Haines Posted June 6, 2008 Author Share Posted June 6, 2008 ...they would be detuned and not worth jack ...for every de-tune there is a 're-tune'... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SVTDEMON Posted June 6, 2008 Share Posted June 6, 2008 ...they would be detuned and not worth jack ...for every de-tune there is a 're-tune'... Very true! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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